Accessibility Minutes 2011 09 26

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Contents

Present

  • Jon Gunderson (University of Illinois - Co-Chair)
  • Ann Abbott (IBM)
  • David Todd (IBM)
  • Prasanna Bale (University Of Illinois)
  • Nick Hoyt (University Of Illinois)
  • Rich Schwerdtfeger (IBM - Co-Chair) - Scribe

Minutes

ongund: http://code.google.com/p/oaa-accessibility-cache-inspector/downloads/list


annabbott: http://openajax.org/pipermail/accessibility/2011-September/thread.htmlscribe: Rich

Jon: There is a new version of the OAA Cache inspector has some for controls rules in it and a list cache

Jon: the cache looks for lists like li, dd, dt, etc. have links in them. If a nav. bar uses these and does not include role="navigation" and suggests doing so

Jon: This is is rules we used for FAE

WCAG 2 Principle 1 Perceiveable Rules

reference: /member/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Principle_1_Perceivable_Rules

David: So that is a recommendaton?

Jon: probably

Jon: I don't know what we do with the landmarks as WCAG has no technieques

Jon: WCAG is eclectic with requirements

Tables

reference: /member/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Principle_1_Perceivable_Rules#Requirement_1.3.1_Info_and_Relationships

Jon: I regoranized the rules we had into 3 groups

Jon: I have rules that apply to simple and complex tables

Jon: Rules that apply to complext data tables and rules that apply to data on the same page

Jon: Rules that apply to simple and complex data tables

Jon: Referring to WCAG complex data tables

Jon: Do you use one of these techniques or a combination thereof

Jon: It appears ambiguous

Rich: They are not done yet. We could give them rules

Jon: I understand. they are not a standards group but they talk about minimum compliance

Jon: I have not seen guidance as to what is sufficient

David: I agree. the more you read the more confused you become

Rich: We should provide that feedback to them

Jon: they asked for comments and are processing those.

Jon: they are publishing updates next month

Jon: they are trying to get an update out next month

annabbott: http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/quickref/#qr-content-structure-separation-programmatic

Ann: there are a lot of requirements but it does not state what you actually need to complete

Ann: If this is a sufficient technique for a success criterion, failing this test procedure does not necessarily mean that the success criterion has not been satisfied in some other way, only that this technique has not been successfully implemented and can not be used to claim conformance.

Jon: Let's get back to the tables

reference: /member/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Principle_1_Perceivable_Rules#Requirement_1.3.1_Info_and_Relationships

Jon: these are rules that apply to simple and complex data tables

TABLE 1: If a table is a data table, each table cell in the first row should be either a TH element or TD element with scope=col

refernce: http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/H51

reference: http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/H63

Rich: This would be a violaton

Jon: you basically use TH elements?

david: yes

Rule TABLE 2: A data table should have a caption element with content

reference: http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/H39

Jon: I have this as a recommendation

Rich: the table should have either a aria-lablledby or

Jon: could you use aria-label

Rule TABLE 2: A data table should have a caption element with content or aria-labelledby reference

Rich: don't think so as if you are sighted you can't see the label unlike with aria-labelledy or caption

David: WCAG does not require a caption

Rich: So then we could make them recommendation to use use either <caption> or aria-labelledby

Jon: so would we make this a for strict or regular

Jon: a couple weeks ago we had requirements for minimum but may want more

Jon: all content should be inside a landmark

Jon: developers like more specific guidance

TABLE 2: A data table should have a caption element with content or aria-labelledby reference

Rule TABLE 3: A data table should have a summary attribute with content or a aria-describedby attribute reference

Jon: since this a simple data table this would be a recommendation?

Rich: does wcag define simple/complext data tables

Jon: we look at row/column spans. A key head element with two or more head elements. ...

Rich: this seems like a lot to process in the cache

nick: FAE Simple Data Table: To qualify as a data table, the table element must (a) contain at least two rows and two columns and (b) have or contain at least one of the following: a summary attribute; a caption element; a thead element; a th element; or a td element with a scope or headers attribute.

nick: FAE Complex Data Table: To qualify as a complex data table, the table element must (a) qualify as a data table and (b) contain any of the following: a thead element that contains two or more tr elements; a tr element with a td or th element with a rowspan or colspan attribute value greater than 1; a tr element that contains at least one td element and two or more th elements; two or more tr...

nhoyt: ...elements that contain only th elements; a tr element with a td or th element with a headers attribute value that contains more than two IDREFs.

Jon: these are in requirement 1.3.1

Jon: I put these definitions at the beginning of requirement 1.3.1 in the wiki

reference: /member/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Principle_1_Perceivable_Rules#Definitions

Jon: a TR element with 2 or more td elements

nick: they are referring to multiple headers

nick: more that two. It could be referring to its role and column header.

david: 1) when there are several sets of row or column headers, or when there are multiple groups of columns or rows (H73) (Nested headers would apply, here)

david: - OR -

david: 2) where the headers are not in the first row/column (H63)

david: - OR -

david: 3) when data cells are associated with more than one row and/or one column header (H43)

david: - OR -

david: 4) when the relationships are too complex to be identified using the th element alone or the th element with the scope attribute (H43)

richardschwerdtfeger: Jon: Do those definitions line up to IBM's definition?

David: I need to look in detail

Jon: If there are more than two thead elements in a table ...

Nick: there is more than one way

david: like if there are multiple THs

Jon: that would be one tr element holding more than one td and more thatn one th elements ...

Jon: david, can you look at the definitions that I put out on the wiki this week?

david: yes

david: do we meet number 2 if we have the last couple?

Jon: well thead is a special container element

TABLE 4: If a table has both a caption element and a summary attribute, the summary attribute content must be unique from the caption element content

Jon: the next rule is table 4

Jon: we should include the use aria-labelleby and aria-describedby

Rich: In HTML 5 they are trying to get rid of the special caption and summary features of tables

Rich: they prefer the aria labelleby and describedy properties

Jon: that should be a battle

rich: yes

rule TABLE 6: If a table is a complex data table, all the TH elements must have unique IDs

rich: is it a violation if they ids are never referenced?

jon: i think that when you reference headers you only reference headers within the table

rich: accessibility apis give each object a unique ID so if the ids in html are not referenced then do we care if they are unique?

nick: regarding TABLE 6: If a TH element has an ID, the ID must unique

nick: that should be fine. id's are supposed to be unique on the page in general

david: IBM tests for unique IDs for the entire page

jongund: rule TABLE 7: If a table is a complex data table, all the TD elements must have a headers attribute that point to TH elements in the same table

jon: we need to think about TABLE_7 and TABLE_8

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